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A Joyful Messenger
Member
Posts: 296

What is the difference between depression and disthimic? How do you tell the difference?

 

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**JOYFUL MESSENGER

January 23, 2012 at 11:58 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Ruth Currah
Site Owner
Posts: 567

Depression can result from feeling trapped, it can be situational. But it can also be a chemical imbalance in the body and have nothing to do with the situation. When it last over six months to a year it is called dysthymic, it can be from the depressive part of bi-polar, it can last a life time. Medication often helps.

January 23, 2012 at 3:54 PM Flag Quote & Reply

A Joyful Messenger
Member
Posts: 296

kinda like making decisions. I feel trapped when I even think about going back to school/college. It's a weird cycle. Think about it and then feel depressed and then do nothing. If I don't do anything the feeling goes away. nice for the time being anyway...but not so good for the long haul. I need to DO!

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**JOYFUL MESSENGER

January 25, 2012 at 11:33 AM Flag Quote & Reply

A Joyful Messenger
Member
Posts: 296

I like this  saying:

It takes three things to Do something (or get something) : first it take Desire, then you must Disipline yourself to do it andonly after you disipline yourself then you will experience delight.

Why do we get stuck on desire and never go much futher?

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**JOYFUL MESSENGER

January 25, 2012 at 11:37 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Ruth Currah
Site Owner
Posts: 567

 

You have got to make all of it all fun. I do not believe in the torture your self with horrible discipline to get started. Lets eliminate that part, it will only depress you. Depression is a result of feeling trapped, and you may feel trapped by the ridiculous idea of being strong willed and disciplined. How dreadful it sounds.

 

If you want to go to college do it in a fun way. First of all you do not have to succeed and never stop college until the dirty deed is finished. So there is no real pressure. Think of it as an opportunity to do what you really really want to do in life, your passion. Think of it as a time of enjoyment away from the daily grind of lousy jobs and lousy pay. You quote religion so lets say you want to go to Bible School. It would be a time of play, of inspiration, of dedication, of growth. And if you do not succeed in staying in school to the end, thats ok. The time there was fun, productive, enjoyable, and you learned something about your passion and how the school thing works.

 

If you do not succeed you can not go back or analyze the situations, what went wrong or did not work and how to do it so it will work. Or you may have found out you need a different school. Who knows, its your life and so no one can tell you that you did it wrong, or failed. How would they know, they are not more aware of your situation and needs then you are. Don't let others be judgmental of you, esp. when they most likely do not even care to take the time to be judgmental.


January 26, 2012 at 3:20 PM Flag Quote & Reply

A Joyful Messenger
Member
Posts: 296

What stops me is there is so much paperwork and forms to fill out...plus the where, what why and hows...too many questions I guess

 

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**JOYFUL MESSENGER

January 27, 2012 at 12:53 PM Flag Quote & Reply

A Joyful Messenger
Member
Posts: 296

fun? it sounds like torture to me!!

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**JOYFUL MESSENGER

January 27, 2012 at 12:54 PM Flag Quote & Reply

A Joyful Messenger
Member
Posts: 296

I like the saying "Dare to succeed" "Dare to be different"

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**JOYFUL MESSENGER

January 27, 2012 at 12:55 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Ruth Currah
Site Owner
Posts: 567

Paper work creates anxiety. To deal with this what you do is start a question or two, when you feel anxiety building up you quit for 5 minutes to let it dissipate. If you let it build up it will take days or weeks to go away. After you feel better do a little more. The secret is to just keep at it off and on. After a while it will be routine. What are some of your other concerns?

January 27, 2012 at 1:04 PM Flag Quote & Reply

A Joyful Messenger
Member
Posts: 296

I guess the feelings of failure...learning disabilities...etc but no excuses right...just do it?

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**JOYFUL MESSENGER

January 30, 2012 at 12:17 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Ruth Currah
Site Owner
Posts: 567

 

Fear of failure is judging yourself as you fear others will judge you. Most people will not judge you and those who do are ignorant to do so because if you went to college at all they should be glad for you, admire your ambition. Failure is a concept you have, not a reality. If you go to college and learn and you loved it until the day you had to quit then glory be. Not going to college can be a failure to you if you want to go. So yah, just do it. No false excuses of imaginary judgmental failures. Look at the up side of it, a new experience. If you fail it is just something to look at, the why, and then try again. Sort of like if you fail a test then study and try again and again until you have passed. The way you learned to walk as a small child.

 

Learning disabilities are no longer a real concern. Every college has an office of learning disabilities. They legally guard your rights to fair testing if you have LDs. Large colleges will test you free to see what they are and then you begin to know how to get around them. I have lots of LDs. I just learned since I was small how to begin to compensate for or do things differently to get around them. Everyone is different, every task is different, no one can do all things for all people, so everyone has some sort of disability, it is part of being human. Harsh judgement of others is a disability, so if you know that they are harshly judging you that you should not get upset, just see their disability is judging too quickly.

By the way, colleges are not judgmental, they are a business and they are in the business of helping you succeed in their college. It is good business to help others succeed. Often they have free counseling, learning, and speech departments to help students become more productive. Small colleges may not be able to afford them if they do not have students and professors in those areas who run the services. Live and learn, try new experiences that help you live and learn.


January 31, 2012 at 12:07 PM Flag Quote & Reply

A Joyful Messenger
Member
Posts: 296

Do you think that winter weather has anything to do with people being more despressed and down at times? What do you think causes depression? And how do you overcome it??

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**JOYFUL MESSENGER

January 18, 2013 at 1:39 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Ruth Currah
Site Owner
Posts: 567

 

Light awakens the brain, in winter the light is less, and for some people they do not feel as alive and awake in winter. For them, twenty minutes every morning in front of an ultra violet light will do the trick. If that does not work there is more to the depression.

 

The next step is to see what in their thinking is depressing them, what is trapping them. Maybe they feel they are not fit for this world, or that others will not respect them, the different thoughts can be as endless as the universe can hold. How they are helped is to look at their thinking and correct their assumptions of helplessness, not by suggesting solutions to their perceived problems but by letting them see their perceived assumptions are only that, perceived. If they are real dangers from real situations then you help them make a realistic plan to best weather the real threats.

 

If non of the above helps, and if their depression runs in the family, in other words, if their depression is genetics then you have a different cause and different ways to deal with it. Basically you want to make them as comfortable as possible, to remove as much depressing circumstances and thoughts as possible. Biologically you want to make sure they are eating healthy, as many foods contribute to manic depressive episodes, or just plain depresses the body. Childhood issues can be contributing to their depression so you look for those sorts of memories and assumptions that depress them, then look at their philosophy. Depression often leads to outlooks that trap them and make them feel more depressed. Also actions, sometimes just about any actions can help life depression, going places, doing things can awaken the body and mind. So you look at their life style.

 

If none of the above helps you may explore looking at medications to help. But meds can be a two edged sword. They need to go to a good psychiatrist, a medical doctor who specializes in medications the affect on the brain. A rule of thumb is that any med will help one third of people, do nothing for one third, and harm one third. So it takes a good doc to make the experience as helpful as possible, a doc who can look at their family tendencies and body chemistry to find the right med.


January 21, 2013 at 10:46 AM Flag Quote & Reply

[email protected]
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Posts: 259

Depression seems to plague a lot of my friends. I have bouts at times. Women in general seems to have more depression. What works to alleviate depression, especially severe depression. I have a friend who seems to be down more then up. At times she does not ever want to come out of her room or get out of bed. It’s hard on her husband too. She neglects him and he gets lonely and down. Then he neglects her and she gets depressed more more depressed. It seems like an endless cycle. I really care a lot about her and would like to help them but I am not sure how to go about it. I would spend time with him to help him help her but that does not seem appropriate. How would you go about it?

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September 5, 2014 at 3:15 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Ruth Currah
Site Owner
Posts: 567



You can look at depression as a shut down of the brain and its four stages. Perceptions slows down or perceive incorrectly in that everything is seen as dreary. Emotions are negative or agitated and can be very sluggish. Thinking slows down or goes into rumination mode, thinking negative thoughts over and over. Activity slows down or gets agitated and scattered. The Upper Nature is not functioning well. The Lower Nature can be activated in that people that are agitated may perceive things in a negative way, be more selfish in their struggle for survival, blame others more or just not see the bigger overall picture, and they can get belligerent. And you are right when you say it is harder for others to live with them as they are not doing things to reward others for their interactive efforts, such as being grateful and gracious. So their relationships become depressive.

 

To ease depression, because there is no sure cure, one should work on all four stages. If we also look at the four stages as perception being biological, emotions emanating from childhood treatment and family dynamics, thinking as being related to beliefs, philosophy, and spirituality, and actions as being politics, or situational factors it gives us another level of understanding to help us alleviate depression.

 

The senses need to be stimulated. Sunlight is very important to wake up the brain. For those that live in overcast in winters or year around and are sessionally depressed 20 minutes with a sun lamp in the mornings can do wonders. Going places, music, tasty foods, some perfume and natural oils, and human touch can really help. Some native or tribal rituals help depression by involving all the above: tribal members sing and dance, have feasts, group hugs, and other activities that stimulate the body and senses. Medically antidepressant drugs help to subdue some of the symptoms of depression.

 

Psychotherapy actually begins to cure depression and so far is the best bet. Medication and psychotherapy together often work well together if medication eases the symptoms of depressing allowing the person to concentrate better in counseling working through childhood and other issues, gaining insights, and conversing in general. Psychotherapy builds up connections in the brain increasing the brains ability to not only to solve problems but produce the chemicals that help us feel pleasure, a sense of well being, and happy feelings.

 

Never underestimate the power of beliefs and spirituality, the ability to have faith and hope. Optimistic outlooks are functions of the Upper Nature and pessimistic outlooks are usually from the Lower Nature of freeze, fight, or flight. Depression is often the result of feeling trapped causing the body to shut down the systems. Beliefs that realistically help us to see light at the end of the tunnel and give us hope help us to avoid or reverse depression. Also beliefs that are purposeful to us, that use our interests, and use our talents lift our spirits and energy levels. We need a purpose beyond our families and careers.

 

Situations that trap us burn us out and often leave us depressed. So we need to engineer our environments with escapes and ‘healing breaks’ from stress and that incorporates our purpose in life and passions. Too much stress creates cortisone hormones that cause inflammations and illness. Just working at doing something, anything, can reverse a lot of the chemical imbalances that cause the symptoms of depression. The human body was designed to be on the go, dancing and singing about who we are and who we love.

 

This is too long so let me know what I have failed to address your issues.


September 7, 2014 at 2:58 PM Flag Quote & Reply

[email protected]
Member
Posts: 259

This may sound odd, but how do you get those little guys to perk up again? I know you said to look around, go to counseling, don't be trapped, and do something but how do I begin. Where do I begin. How do I begin when I feel like shit. Its the first step that may be the hardest. I just don't seem to have the oomph to get out of my stalled car and push it. Once it is moving maybe I can jump in and kick start it. But it is that first step that just does not happen. What should I do? 

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September 11, 2014 at 1:42 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Ruth Currah
Site Owner
Posts: 567

Sorry, I didn’t give more concrete answers. I will try now to give examples of each stage of the diagrams above. I will try not to repeat myself but add new things. I have bouts of low time. I will tell you how I nip them in the bud once I realize I am sinking more and more. I do my best to avoid sinking further where I may not want to live in a functional world. It is ok when grieving to allow yourself low times to review the recent and not so recent past so you can rewrite the present. If you refer to the diagrams above and the steps of Upper and Lower nature the following may make more sense or at least seem more concrete.

 

Step (1) Ant and Bee: When depressed the world looks dark and dreary. Like a Zen buddhist you want to be in the moment and look around, some people meditate, but I just try and take in whats around as if it is good art. I let my mind empty and be filled with the sensations, sights, sounds, smell and taste if there is food, and touch and textures. It use to help when I had a non stop job to get rest in-between tasks by noticing just spots on the walls or desks as I walked from one task to another. Spiedie (5) will try and bring up the old crud. But Mr/Ms Do, our conscious choice, rejects the stuff and concentrates on the moment. I will do this for perhaps an hour or less until my mind is clear again.

 

Step (2) Macho fear and loving Cuddles: At this point as you let in your emotions Consciousness chooses to ignore the fears and concentrate on good and loving emotions. What I do is to bring up memories of the best of times with my loving Grandma and Mom, or friends and other relatives. After half an hour or so, or less depending on how depressed I am, my mood begins to lighten. I follow this with guided imagery, I may become a small flying dot and I glide around looking at things not in my immediate environment. I may fly over the ocean or rest on the neck feather of flying bird, I may walk up a tree trunk like an ant. What ever your brain likes to do from your experiences. What we are doing is changing path ways in the brain from ruminating about negative emotions to positive ones. Raccoon (6), the selfish centered scoundrel will try and sing the poor me tunes but Mr/Ms Do makes the choice, perhaps over and over, to get back on the pleasant track.

 

Step (3) Geru is a where the work begins, this is where psychotherapy comes in handy to rebuild the positive productive parts of the brain to help you sustain your positive happy self. What we perhaps have done is trapped ourselves with our thought and assumptions. Now is when I let the fears creep back. But as they creep back I confront and challenge them. I may have been thinking that no body cares about me. I begin to challenge that. Often such thinking comes from childhood when perhaps our parents were not as attentive as we needed them to be, or they were abusive. I will let my mind drift back to those times. There was a time I was afraid of going to the doctor. Then I remembered being on my death bed as a kid. Because of steps (1) and (2) or because I may be talking to a counselor or a friend the memories do not pile up as depression but Mr/Ms Do can challenge the fears and say something like, but you made it and are still alive and you can make it again, you are strong and you lived because others cared.

 

The situations and thoughts are as varied as the number of people and their experiences. But one tendency we have is to blame others, Crow (7). We may think we are depressed because so and so did this or that. Such thinking traps us as we can not readily change others. Once we accept who they are for what ever unknown reasons and take them as we would the weather, then we are free to plan how to get out of the funk without their specific input. We begin to take responsibility and with responsibility comes control. We can now make plans, plan A, plan B, plan C. We should make plans to use our interests and talents to do things that are meaningful to us.

 

Here is where spirituality and faith come in, possibility thinking that takes us beyond our entrapping thoughts. Look at spirituality as everything healthy we haven’t thought about that helps us keep our spirits up. Sometimes that is a football game we cheer at, but spirituality is cheering at the unseen, the perfection of possibility. Religions like the Gospel can give us hope and enlightenment on daily interactions. The Moslem religion can give us daily routines and quiet prayer times that give strength. Religions are developed over thousands of years that have soothed and contributed to mental health. If you are thinking of radicals and terrorist at this moment, well, let your Mr/Ms Do distinguish between negative and positive thoughts. If you are thinking religions are nonsense, well, as a kid did you find help and wisdom in any type of literature? Why accept Donald Duck but condemn writings that have inspired and uplifted people through out the ages. I am not suggesting religion is only literature. People transcend and enter into life changing spiritual states that are as real as another experiences. Drugs and alcohol can alter our spirits but only briefly. Religions can alter for life.

 

Step (4) is to act. Sometimes it does not matter what you do just do something. But do keep in mind doing drugs or alcohol or addictions as gambling or sexual affairs will bring you down, tear down your brain connections for the real world and leave you destitute. Coyote (8) can give us aggressive responses. Many depressed teenage boys have joined gangs to take out their fears, anger, and depression on doing damage to other boys in other gangs. This is when Dragon is strong and encouraging Spiedie, Raccoon, and Crow to basically create war, kids or adults.

 

So try and do things that will lead to health possibilities. Go to school, hike, walk, hobbies. You also want to think about the body. When I start to go down hill it can be that my blood sugar is too low and a candy bar will do wonders. Sometimes it is because I lack vitamin D and a few pills will do the trick. Then my thyroid may be sluggish and iodized salt is the answer. My good doc helps me with blood tests to determine which one it is.

 

Well, tell me if this was helpful or where you want me to go from here. Sorry it was so long.

September 12, 2014 at 1:40 PM Flag Quote & Reply

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